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Published: December 17, 2009
Another ‘Catholic’ school to mark off your list
Dominican University in San Rafael includes Planned Parenthood on list of approved internship programs for psychology students
 For at least three years, the Dominican University of California in San Rafael provided a list of Marin County organizations at which psychology students could satisfy a ‘field placement’ requirement required for obtaining a degree. Among the lengthy list of organizations posted on the school’s website for student placement was Planned Parenthood.
The school, with an enrollment of about 2100, describes itself as “an independent university of Catholic heritage.” It was founded in 1890 by the Congregation of the Holy Name, commonly known as the Dominican Sisters of San Raphael, according to the university’s website. “The University seeks to embody the Dominican educational ideals: love of truth, beauty, and the life of the mind, and a deep respect for the dignity and worth of the individual,” says the website.
The school, located 12 miles north of San Francisco in Marin County, offers about 60 academic programs, among them psychology. On the psychology department’s webpage, a list is provided of “Strategic Initiatives and Partnerships” – the organizations approved by the department for undergraduate “field placement.”
Between 2005-2007, the lengthy list included abortion provider and contraceptive promoter Planned Parenthood. (The full list is provided below.) Attempts by California Catholic Daily to reach the head of the psychology department or a spokesman from the university’s public affairs office to determine whether Planned Parenthood remains on the list were unsuccessful. A secretary with the psychology department said it would be difficult to reach anyone for comment since the school is currently not in session.
In addition to Planned Parenthood, the psychology department also lists the Spectrum Center for Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender Concerns as an approved organization for satisfying the field placement requirement. The center’s website, whose homepage features a photo of state Sen. Mark Leno, a prominent backer of same-sex marriage, describes its mission as providing “community leadership to promote acceptance, understanding, and full inclusion for lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people.”
Below is a full list of approved “placements” for undergraduate psychology students posted on the department’s webpage:
9 Grove Lane, Huckleberry House
A.P. Giannini Middle School, San Francisco
American Sports Institute
Bay Area Community Resources
Breast Cancer Research Project
Buckelew Programs, Transition Age Youth
California Pacific Medical Center, Play Therapy Department, San Francisco
Canal Community Alliance
CASA: Court Appointed Special Advocate
Center for Attitudinal Healing
Children’s Hospital Autism Intervention (Oakland)
Children’s Hospital Oakland Research Institute (Oakland):
Coleman Elementary School
Community Violence Solutions
Consortium for Children
County Community School
Danbury House, Richmond
Drawbridge
Family Paths (Oakland)
Friends Outside
Giant Steps Equestrian Center
Girls on the Run
Halleck Creek Riding Program
Helen Vine Detox Center
Hospice of Marin
Image for Success
Life House
Love is the Answer
Love2dance
Marin Abuses Women’s Services
Marin Academy
Marin AIDS Project
Marin County Adult Probation Department
Marin County Juvenile Probation
Marin County Older Adult Services
Marin County STAR Program
Marin County Youth Court
Marin Head Start
Marin Interfaith Youth Outreach (MIYO)
Marin Literacy Project
Marin Services for Men
Marin Services for Women
Marin Suicide Prevention and Community Counseling
Mayflower Center
New Beginnings
Novato Human Need Center
Ohlhoff Recovery Programs
Pacific Diversified Services
Planned Parenthood
Ritter House
San Francisco General Hospital, Psychiatry Department, San Francisco
San Rafael High School
Special Programs for Youth, San Francisco
Spectrum Center for Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual and Transgender Concerns
St. Vincent’s School for Boys
Suicide Prevention
Sunny Hills Services
Total Golf Adventures
Valley Kids Program
Walden House, San Francisco
West Marin Senior Services
YMCA Mentoring Program
Of the field placement and internship program, the psychology department has this to say, “The fieldwork experience provides an opportunity to see and work with the human issues previously read about, thought about, and written about in the traditional classroom setting. This process includes encountering the psychological realities of a real person in real institutions, with all the humanity, complexity and subtlety, which characterizes an individual human life in context. Here you will confront and wrestle with moral dilemmas involved in choosing among alternative solutions and interventions. As you struggle with the limitations of your own learning, you will encounter the profound ethical issues involved in deciding between what a person needs and what he or she can currently use and assimilate. The experience acts as a pivotal test of whether this kind of life work is what you want to do and where you want to be.”
Tuition, fees, room and board, books and supplies, transportation and personal expenses for the 2009-2010 academic year at Dominican were estimated by the school at $44,058.
Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 4:32 AM By Mary Jo
I am very sorry to say that I graduated from this once Catholic college in 1968. Since that time the college has become more of a secular institution. Fortunately I do not have to rely in any way on my degree from this school. Instead I proudly claim the Pontifical University of St. Thomas Aquinas in Rome as my Alma Mater. I have not given one cent to Dominican College and would never do so. Also, I would not recommend this institution to any Catholic young person.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 5:13 AM By Ron
You either are Catholic or you ain't. Dominican U. appears to fall into the ain't category. God Bless
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 5:40 AM By WOODY GUIDRY
DILEMMAS, TRILEMMAS, BETWEEN ROCKS AND HARD PLACES, TWO-HORNED AND THREE-HORNED DILEMMAS inferred by the psychology department for student field placement sounds a little restrictive-UNLESS some of us watchng from the sidelines are recognized as being confronted with the very same kinds of decisions regarding just what to call such institutions. "Catholic"-you think that you should called THAT???
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 5:40 AM By Jim
Dominican has been "Catholic" in name only for many years. This is no surprise.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 5:54 AM By Leann
Good for them! I think it's outstanding to promote an understanding of all of God's children.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:41 AM By Brian McN. Canada
SILENCE IS GOLDEN?
Not in this case! Who is the Judas in this School of Higher Learning?
Evil is Evil...and there can not be found any good sources in these organizations
Catholics and all Christians must all stand up and fight the Infiltration of Evil...Every abomination, must be protested by all!
When YOU see an attack on the "normal" way of life...immediately write a short note of protest and mail it, by email or post office, phone into radio and TV talk shows and "Protest Loudly"...silence is Not Golden--it is interpreted to agreement.
Stand up...shout out! Chase the Evil Ones out of Our Society...and "Do It Now"...it only takes a few minutes to express you dissatisfaction with things you do not believe in, and Do Not Want.
Pass this on to Relatives and Friends...start standing up, and speaking out, now!
Thank You!
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 7:50 AM By Georgia
Garbage in----Garbage out. $44,058; that can sure buy a lot of garbage.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 7:55 AM By Rita
Hello ...... I am a transgendered woman.
My mother is a deeply devoted Catholic.
I am a Christian but not a Catholic as I am not allowed.
This is definately a school I WILL BE MARKING ON MY LIST and TELLING OTHERS of!
Such good news! ...finally a step away from willful ignorance and a step towards understanding! An educational institution living up to it's calling! .....how refreshing! ...some light in a dark and dusty place!
May God richly bless this institution and it's students.
May the students become wise leaders.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 8:13 AM By Paul
Rita what you are is ignorant and most likely a liar. Why don't you first find out what the Church teaches on any given subject before condemning it!
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:09 AM By JLS
Leann, the problem you're stuck in is believing that living an intellectual life of error and deception, such as secular psychology indoctrinates, can lead to understanding of anyone. All it does is lead to some shallow understanding of the utilitarian objectives of secular rulership.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:11 AM By bluprntguy
I am very disappointed to see this article. Jesus taught that we should care for ALL our less fortunate neighbors. In fact, he built a ministry dedicated to caring for those that had been cast out from his society. Today's Catholics appear to care more about judging and condemning others in an effort to harm them. Catholics have become the very people that Jesus preached against - enraptured with their own self righteousness. Perhaps Catholics should go back, read their bibles, and actually do what jesus would do: care for your fellow human beings and treat them with kindness, dignity and respect.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 9:12 AM By JLS
Rita, you have all but said it plainly, "May the students become wise leaders": So, obviously you have noted that they are not wise. Why would you recommend a college where the students are not wise?
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 11:13 AM By Grisha
Rita - It sounds like you're a baptized Catholic. If so, by definiton, you are "allowed." In fact as far as joining us at mass or other servoces, EVERYONE is "allowed" Consider coming back.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 11:35 AM By JLS
More deception from the post of bluprntguy: His religion is based on forgetting that God comes first and then self and neighbor. The Church is founded on Jesus, not on the idea of social justice. Jesus helps the poor by giving them the truth, not by indulging their sins.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 1:16 PM By Abeca Christian
Yuck not another bad school!
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 1:48 PM By Maryanne Leonard
Folks, if you want your child educated in California in a good Catholic college, Thomas Aquinas is one of the finest in the nation, with a curriculum based on the Great Books and a solidly Catholic environment. Rita, I am sorry you were called a liar on this forum, and extremely sorry you feel you are "not allowed" in a Catholic church. I can't believe that. I hope you will be encouraged to look into it. Jesus taught us to love one another as He loved us. Somtimes it is hard to live up to His teachings, and hard for someone like me to understand what caused you to change your gender, but I truly believe you would be welcomed in any Catholic church by all who are following His teachings, and certainly by the Church itself. Please look into this, and please consider coming home to the Catholic Church again and becoming of service to others, the surest path to personal happiness.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 2:05 PM By Rita
Thank you for allowing my original post....
Paul ..... thank you for the assessment of my character and knowledge ..... you demonstrate my point beautifully and I shall comment no further.
JLS ..... students attend school to learn and become even more wise..... I was wishing them success at school and in the years beyond. I do hope that is not taken as offensive. As for recommending schools ..... if asked I would certainly suggest to a student that they carefully look at not only what a school stands for or agianst ...but also why.
Grisha ...yes I am a baptized Catholic and attended for many years. Thank you for the invitation back.
Interesting feedback..... would I be welcome in the pew next to you??? Just a thought ...please ...not looking to start an argument here. I just hoped that a comment from outside may be helpful. Again....sincerely..... thank you for allowing me to be part of the discussion.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 4:36 PM By Tom P
Rita-
There is no such thing as a "transgendered woman". For that matter, there is no such thing as a "transgendered man." In your case, you always were a male, and you remain male. I pray to God you have not mutilated yourself.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:18 PM By Dan
Tom P, scientifically, since Rita carries the XY chormosome, she is a man. But I'm sure surgical evidence of this has been removed, and traits common to women introduced. I too cannot fathom that a man would feel happier with the physical appearance of a woman and shot up with feminine hormones. There are many things I don't understand. But Rita, you would be welcome to sit next to me in Church any time. I know every person I sit next to in Church each week is a fallbile imperfect individual just like me. And I go to Church because I need Divine grace to help me get through life, I go to Church open handed to God with one simple prayer -in my heart - "HHEELLLPPPP!!!! " and also "Thanks for loving me." Every kiss of grace is a treasured moment, and most of these come to me at Mass or in prayer before our Lord in the Blessed Sacrament. Don't let anyone keep you from Divine Mercy.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:25 PM By Margie
Tom P, there is very much such a thing as a "transgendered woman" or a "transgendered man" in that it identifies a self-view that a minority of people report to have. Thus, to the extent that there are people who report such a self-view, transgendered persons do in fact exist. As to surgery, the Vatican has stated that while there may be some cases where surgery is of benefit to the person, the Vatican has to date, as far as I'm aware, not identified any specific cases. Transgenderism and surgery should not be confused with an alleged actual change in the person's sex. Thus, it's one thing to deny that one can actually change one's sex and it's another to admit that there are in fact "transgendered" persons, i.e. persons who experience a contrary, conflicting or ambiguous self-perception of themselves with regard to their gender/sex.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 6:41 PM By MarkF
Rita, I lived my life as a homosexual man for over thirty years before coming back to the Church. At that point I decided to move my life away from homosexual action and thoughts. I accepted Jesus as unconditionally as he accepts me. Now, God knows I'm not perfect and no one with my history walks away from something in one day. But I try, and I'm open to God's healing grace. I'm just asking you to consider that what the Church teaches is true on matters of human sexuality. You don't have to beat yourself up unnecessarily because of your sexual identity issues. But please, for the love of God, you also don't have to give in to them either. But far, far more dangerous is to believe the false religion that praises things like homosexual behavior and yes my friend, also the lie that says that you are not the gender that you were born to. These ideas lead only to pain. I'm sure if you are in the transgendered community you know very well that there is a shockingly high level of suicide, alcohol and drug problems. Let me say this again...you don't have to be perfect all the time, just to do your best and to believe what the Church teaches.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 7:03 PM By Mark from PA
Rita, Grisha is correct. I would hope that you would be welcomed in a Catholic Church. Have you ever checked to see if there is a Dignity chapter close to where you live? Perhaps they could give you support. You can also look up Welcoming Churches to see if there is a Catholic Church in your area where you would be welcome and feel safe in. Thank you for sharing your witness. This is difficult for many people to understand and by sharing your story you help others to be more understanding.
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 7:55 PM By JLS
Rita, your rhetoric reveals an issue besides your gender confusion. Obviously you are aware of some deep interest in the Church. After all, St Augustine says that our hearts are restless until they rest in Christ. How do you propose to regain the Sacraments, given the unchangeable doctrines of the Church? Or is your laconic mood, which is possibly boosted by meds, what you prefer over the joy of the Lord?
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 8:32 PM By Grisha
Rita: Yes! You'd also be welcome to join us at the nearby sports bar after the 11:00 mass for brinch. :-)
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 10:13 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
Hmmm, I wonder why NARTH is not listed as a good partner in this list? After all, they are certified Psychologists and Planned Parenthood probably has few or no Psycologists!.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts,
Kenneth M. Fisher
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Posted Thursday, December 17, 2009 11:56 PM By 1abqdad
Rita - It is truly sad when someone "self-excommunicates" as a result of ignorance on their part or the ignorance of others. I can NOT tell you how many times I have heard really silly "rules" from self-proclaimed Catholic "experts" who were totally WRONG! I would hope that you would consider finding an orthodox, compassionate priest to discuss your specific concerns. You are most certainly "allowed"..and Yes, you would be most welcome in the pew next to me. I'll save a place for you...
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 12:03 AM By Abeca Christian
Rita I am sorry that you are a confused child. May our Lord help you turn away from sin. Not all people that call themselves Christian are truly Christian, not all that call out "lord lord" will be heard.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 12:03 AM By 1abqdad
This school has been outside of Catholic teachings for a long time. This is simply another indication of their heresy. Sadly, they join a long list of heretic, pseudo-Catholic schools in California...joining Santa Clara and USF in the Bay Area. What is really upsetting is the failure of both the Vatican and the USCCB to disassociate them with the Church! Their failure destroys the credibility of the church in the USA AND puts vulnerable young Catholics "at risk" because they do NOT realize that the school is in heresy.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 12:06 AM By John
It is ridiculous to condemn a university because of a possible internship with Planned Parenthood. The internship program was in the psychology department; the students would obviously not be performing abortions, but would probably be counseling women who had or are considering one. These students could also have the experience to see the horrors of abortion which could bring them into working for the pro-life movement. Anyone who would condemn a university for this practice is very ignorant and closed minded.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 7:00 AM By Rita
Tom P : for years I also was of your point of view as I fought against how I was created. I suppose intersexed persons do not exist either???.... Do you know the story of Galileo and Copernicus and the Catholic church? One day a similar story will unfold for us that are slightly different than you may be comfortable with. Thank you all for allowing my comments and perhaps I should leave now as I did not come here to cause any difficulty.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 8:27 AM By Canisius
More progessive garbage, and of course Grisha is the first to defend it. The civil war cannot come soon enough,,..how many souls will be lost to Hell, have you asked yourself that one Grisha all your "tolerance and diversity" wont get a single soul to heaven. You never answer that question do you, oh most tolerant Grisha????
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 9:14 AM By Abeca Christian
Rita you were not created that way. It is all in your mind and your willingness to embrace sin and rebel against God, has put you where you are at right now. Capisci!
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 9:31 AM By Rita
For those of you that have responded with welcome, love, and respect .... thank you so very much!
For those of you that have questioned my character, motives, and possible use of drugs ..... I appreciate you as well and you have no ill will from me. I do not know you personally and I do not feel I am in a position to judge your life in any way.
For those that see me as sinful, misguided, and not nearly knowledgable enough ..... I plead guilty on all counts .... though perhaps not in the ways you may wish. I have a long ways to go but this I do know ... I too am a child of God and I am happy for that and He is my all in all. Being a typical man or a typical woman or a transgendered person is not in itself sinful as far as I can tell. How we express and live out that truth in our lives can be either good or sinful. I am trying very hard, like any other person, to live my life in a good way and I hope that sincerity is evident. For those that find me unsavory and uncomfortable, I really do apologize for intruding on your comfortable space (no malice intended really)
Just so you know .... the way I found this discussion is that I keep track of transgender news on Google. When I saw this article I was hoping to be able to pass on some heartfelt good wishes on what I see as progress towards understanding.
Final thoughts ...... I am so glad to see that by some people here that there is a willingness to learn about and appreciate others for who they are. I am currently investigating a new church home and we will see what comes of that though I will say I feel no leadings towards a Catholic church (that is not a judgement just a report on my sense of direction). I am so glad that there are Catholic learning institutions that are reaching out to learn, understand and teach and I welcome and I am thankful for that.
Rita
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 10:06 AM By Dan
"Thank you all for allowing my comments and perhaps I should leave now as I did not come here to cause any difficulty. " Rita, whether you leave or not is up to you. But the imperative for all of us, inlcuding yourself, is to depend upon Jesus for our true inner happiness now, and our eternal salvation. He does not disappoint. Don't ever let anything come between you and Him; that's the only sure advice I could give you-- or anyone-- for that matter.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 10:14 AM By JLS
John, have you been wandering in the desert and eating the datura plants? Your assumption that Catholic psychology student interns are busy working for Planned Parenthood and converting them and all their victims reveals a mind overcome with hallucination.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 10:24 AM By JLS
Rita, how many followers have you gained for your religion? BTW, just in case you might actually be seeking truth instead of recruiting souls to sinful ways, let me explain something about "made in the image and likeness of God": After God created man in His image and likeness, man sinned. The consequence is damage to what God created. Those whose phsyical or genetic nature is not the way it should be (according to the Tradition of Abraham, Moses, Jesus and St Paul, and the Magisterium) suffer that particular disorder due to the Fall of man brought on by that first sin of man. Any "intersexed" individual reflects creation only in so far as the "intersex" aspect does not extend. Your physical and or genetic nature does not rule over your will. Your will is created by God to choose Him and not anything else, whether you are intersexed or otherwise. You could even be a nearly perfect specimen of nature, but that also does not rule over your will. Notice that even the physical nature of Jesus, although perfect, did not rule over His will. He said to the Father, "Not my will but thine". Your salvation, Rita, is not in your opinion, your emotion, your will, but in God's will, which by His own words, abides in the Catholic Church. There is no other means of salvation; without the Catholic Church no one can gain Heaven. When you cut your ties with the Church, you cut your ties with Heaven.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 10:27 AM By Maryanne Leonard
Rita, please do not leave now, and you did not cause any difficulty! You are a Catholic and a person who has a lot to deal with. I hope you will come to feel that the best way for you to dwell in the love of Jesus Christ and to worship him is to come home to the Catholic Church. I know you have been hurt both inside and outside of church settings, but it is important for the eternal salvation of your soul, to say nothing of the peace you can find worshipping Jesus in the Church begun by Jesus Christ himself, to come home to the Church. You will be welcome to sit next to me or anywhere else you would like. I may not share your personal journey or even fully understand it, any more than you might fully be able to relate to my life's journey, but we share a faith in Jesus Christ, and we are both Catholics, and it would be an occasion of joy for me to learn that you would be willing to start attending Mass again and feel the love Jesus Christ has for you. We all need that, as well as the guidance that we receive by truly listening to the Word of God and the teachings of the Catholic Church. Please believe me, we are imperfect sinners inside the Church, but all right-thinking Catholics would be thrilled to have you back in the Church.
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Posted Friday, December 18, 2009 10:33 AM By Grisha
Canisius: Could I ask you to reflect on your 8:27 AM post? If by defending "it" you mean Dominican's placement list, I wasn't writing about that. What I did do is invite a baptized Catholic to come back to the Church. Unless a person is an Atheist or extremist Protestant Fundementalist, how can anyone object to that? I don't know who the parties of this "civil war" you wish for is supposed to be between, however I don't believe the Prince of Peace agrees with you. Have I gotten a single soul to Heaven by trying to bring lapsed Catholics back to the Church? How could I possibly know?
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Posted Saturday, December 19, 2009 11:38 AM By Tony de New York
Grisha u r right! we need to invite those Catholics that have left, pushing them to the other side is anti - Catholic.
Food for thought.
4If any of you has a hundred sheep, and one of them gets lost, what will you do? Won't you leave the ninety-nine in the field and go look for the lost sheep until you find it? 5And when you find it, you will be so glad that you will put it on your shoulder 6and carry it home. Then you will call in your friends and neighbors and say, "Let's celebrate! I've found my lost sheep."
Saint Luke 15, 4-5.
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Posted Saturday, December 19, 2009 6:13 PM By JLS
Tony dNY, maybe they're not lost. Not everyone who leaves Christendom is lost. Many who attack the Church are not lost at all, but opposed to God.
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Posted Sunday, December 20, 2009 4:52 AM By RR
Rita should not leave the Church, but if she continues in her sins she needs to stay away from the sacraments. If she receives Holy Communion with these mortal sins on her soul, it is a sacrilige and it brings scandal to God and His Church. Her soul would be damned. She needs to make a good confession, ammend her life, stop offending God, remain in the Church, and pick up her cross and live by God's will and not her own.
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Posted Sunday, December 20, 2009 3:53 PM By MarkF
Can I take a position down the middle? I agree that all are welcome to come to Mass and that anyone who wants to be made clean by the sacraments should be open to do so. No one comes to the Church in a perfect condition. That is why we seek her out, to be made well. But I have real problems with all sorts of types - and I don't mean this Rita person specifically - who come to Church to have her affirm them in their sins. In my brief two years back in the Church I've learned one key prayer, "You will be done Lord, not mine." That means to give up everything that is not of God and be prepared to follow him no matter what. The modern cafeteria Catholic does not pray this and does not believe this. Humility is lacking when we place what we believe over what the Church teaches. It is the teaching of the Church that we are not disposed to receive communion when we are in serious dissent, and any part of the gay ideology is serious dissent. My other thought is to ask whether we have people joining the Church to change themselves or to change the Church? If they are sincere in their wish to change themselves, I believe that a sincere heart is needed, a heart that is willing to let go of any and all parts of the gay ideology, part of which is the superstition that goes under the name of "transgendered." Failing that, Mass attendance, yes. Communion, no.
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Posted Sunday, December 20, 2009 4:35 PM By Canisius
Grisha it is probably a safe bet that you have not gotten any soul to heaven, but its a safe bet that with your corruption of the Truth you have probably caused a few souls to go to hell
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Posted Monday, December 21, 2009 8:15 PM By Mark from PA
RR, you are being very presumptuous in accusing Rita of mortal sin. You do not know her and you cannot make this judgement. You don't know that she is offending God by being who she is. She needs to discern God's will for her and let His love guide her. I hope that she can find a parish where she will be accepted and welcomed.
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 7:19 AM By Grisha
MarkF: Let me suggest that for us, unlike the evangelicals who can tell you the moment they were "Born Again", conversion, or as in your case and mine, "re conversion" is a long, slow process. The first step on the journey is usually returning to a mass or even a parish social event or a chat with a priest. After that, while lay people like us can support the process, it's basically up to Father and of course, God.
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 9:44 AM By JLS
MarkF, Grisha is waxing seductive in trying to lay a load of despair on your neck. Keep with Jesus, not with Grisha. Grisha, as you obviously see, behaves in the slippery manner of many homosexuals. He will not respond manfully to any criticism but instead presents more mush and corruption as if it is something good. It is these souls who act out the most lukewarm manners they can, thinking them to be sensitive, kind, loving, charitable, faithful and devout. But they are anything other than these virtues.
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 3:37 PM By MarkF
JLS, I don't agree with your criticism of Grisha. I'd have to say that Grisha and I have pastoral differences, but that's fine.
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 3:40 PM By Grisha
JLS: If you can have a 30 second convesation with a lapsed Catholic and bring him or her back tp the Church, great! As for me, to quote Inspector Harry Callahan, who was quoting John Milius, CS Lewis or Dante, "A man's got to know his limitatios." Seductive? Good grief!
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 4:08 PM By MarkF
Grisha, I agree with what you said that the Catholic view of spiritual life is a process, not an instant. Anyway, this is a digression. My real point is to ask you how involved are you willing to get move a person further? Why I think you get slammed on here is because you seem to have a rather loose notion of what it means to be disposed to receive communion. A few times before you've hinted that you think that it is enough to believe in the Credo to be disposed to receive communion. From what I understand, this is completely not enough to be disposed for communion. Why is this important for lay people to understand this? Because the clergy are too busy to educate everyone. That is our job as lay Catholics. This call for the laity to evangelize is straight out of Vatican II, the real Vatican II not the high jacked version. Where I think we disagree is that you don't think it's your job to evangelize. You also don't seem cognizant of the danger to the faith when people come into the Church not to be changed, but to change the Church. This is what's happened in so-called gay parishes. They pastors have been charitable but lax in a way that you seem to support. And what's happened is that these people have changed the parishes, while they have remained the same. I'd say the same thing is true for all the modern issues - contraception, cohabitation, selffishness, greed, etc. I don't have an answer to any of this. But I'd like to ask you to be open to the call of Pope Benedict to sort out how to speak the truth with charity. Why you get slammed on here is because you seem to side with just charity while downplaying the truth, or that you just want to leave it all in God's hands. Anyways, just let me say again that I think you're a good solid Catholic and that while I disagree with some of what you've said, I think you get slammed too harshly on here.
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 5:15 PM By JLS
Yes, Grisha, "seductive". Ok, MarkF, I'll retract my query into Grisha's psyche. Furthermore, I don't quite believe it myself. Grisha, "seductive" is, I submit (to borrow from the grande style of Maguire), contrary to the limitations a man's got to be apprised of on his own accord when considering all that "limits" applies to not only in this world but in other worlds and in the cyberworld in particular (hmn, I don't think Maguire would use the phrase "in particular", as it's too provencial for accompaniment of his rhetoric (( see footnote 9)). Footnote 9: See footnote 2b.40a. For footnote 2b.40a, see footnote 9. Q.E.D.
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 9:47 PM By The Truth Hurts
Mark F, JLS is right. When it comes to homosexual issues Grisha's idea of Catholicism is not much different than Mark from PA. A while back a very good priest who used to blog here regularly would have disagreed with your assertion that Grisha is a solid Catholic. Solid Catholics do not influence or encourage fellow Catholics to accept sin or attend same sex weddings. Just as you have reminded us not to get caught up in the web of spinning dialogue with Mark from PA, JLS's words about Grisha waxing seductive are very true. When it comes to accepting Grisha's different lay back style, (of encouragement comments for the homosexual lifestyle) there is nothing solidly Catholic about ignoring God's plan for marriage to be between a man and a woman. Grisha gives himself away when he says that evangelizing others is not his cup of tea and he does not feel qualified to encourage others to *not* offend God....but notice Mark that Grisha certainly has no problem encouraging others to *offend* God by attending a same sex wedding or for Aaron to keep on offending God with his Spanish boyfriend. Solid? No! Slippery? Yes! Almost slippery enough to fool you! Be kind but be careful !
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Posted Tuesday, December 22, 2009 11:39 PM By Kenneth M. Fisher
To truly love someone, you must desire their salvation. To do that you must be willing to lovingly correct them when you see or sense that they are falling into sin, mortal or venial. To ignore it when you see or sense they are falling in to sin, is to truly hate them. This is especially true when you neglect to offer them correction because you don't want to hurt their feelings.
God bless, yours in Their Hearts.
Kenneth M. Fisher
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 6:38 AM By Grisha
Mark F : Let me begin by confessing that I have a sinful prejudice. Having grown up in an Anti Catholic town and had my teeth knocked out because I was wearing a Catholic school uniform, I have a tendency to pre-judge, if not individual Protestants, then Protestantism in general. Thus when Catholics adopt Protestant practices such as Elmer Gantry style preaching or being a "self taught ministers” my hackles get raised. I understand and accept on faith the teachings of the Church on worthiness to take communion. What I have said is I object to the divisive labels "Orthodox, Traditional, or even Faithful" as used here which implies that the rest of us are somewhat less than full and complete Roman Catholics. I believe that baptism and reciting and believing the creeds and renewal of one's baptismal promises define one as a traditional and orthodox Catholic. This is a MINIMUM (1) and does not extend to one’s eligibility for communion. In answering your initial question I try to go far but I don't think I'm qualified to go very deep." One example I DO NOT FEEL QUALIFIED TO ADVISE ANOTHER CATHOLIC ON RECEIVING COMMUNION OR NOT. I BELIEVE SOME OF THE LAY POSTERS HERE MAY BE, MOST ARE NOT AND A FEW , AS MY DEAR DEPARTED MOTHER WOULD SAY, HAVE IT "BASS-ACKWARDS" (1) Apologies for the flaming, however the program CCD uses won't let us use bold, underline or italics.
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 6:40 AM By Grisha
Mark F (Con’td) My progress on evangelization is slow. One friend of mine has been away for 30 years. He jokes if he went to confession he's have to plea begin. He's a vet and we got him into a prayer service when one of our kids received his second purple heart (His name is Ramsey. He's eligible for his THIRD (1) deployment in less than a year. Please pray for him). Another time he spelled me guarding the Rosary Society ladies after a whacko tore up the church when they were gathered. With him I keep trying. I helped convince one woman to come back from the Episcopalians and de-cohabitate with her abusive boyfriend (He's also a cradle Catholic and I'd like to see him return to the faith after attending services in the San Quentin Chapel - Oops, there goes my reputation for being charitable) We have too few priests. Like you I don't have an answer beyond an occasional prayer and encouraging my daughter to encourage her students to explore if they are being called to priestly or religious life. I do believe that (and here comes the criticism) we ought 1)to make wider use of the permanent deaconate, 2)Have a "fast track" program for theologically knowledgeable deaconate candidates, 3) Allow widower deacons to re-marry and (here comes the FIRESTORM of criticism) 4) open the permanent deaconate to women. As for the "gay parishes," I've never been to one. I'll hit MHR's 10:00 AM mass and social hour one of these days and give you a report. I've got Cardinal Ratzinger's book you recommended on my reading list ad will order t it from the SF Public library, one of the few branches of our City Gov't that actually works. (1) Apologies for the flaming, however the program CCD uses won't let us use bold, underline or italics.
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 6:48 AM By RR
MarkF: I think you are going a little soft here. I think Grisha is a very nice and kind man, BUT from what I read here I can't say I think he is a solid Catholic. He dissents from Catholic teaching on this blogsite all the time. I can't believe you don't see it. He condones gays, going to same sex weddings, he approves homosexuality, he thinks you can receive the sacraments with mortal sins on your soul... and numerous other anti-Church teachings. I hope the progressives on here aren't getting to you. You are an example of a good, solid Catholic, not Grisha.
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 7:18 AM By Canisius
MarkF: Grisha invites the "slamming" he gets on this board. He is a typical left wing "progressive" who has infected the Church with his "tolerance and diversity", will not distinguish good from evil, and does hot have the courage to defend the Church from its enemies. That is left to people like me, On another point, you wanted to details of the incident involving my nephew and the man hating lesbian who assaulted him when he was child a few weeks back. I spelled it out, but the publishers did not print it. Let me sum it up, she is no longer able to chew solid foods, and I'll stop right there. Church Militant forever
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 7:38 AM By Grisha
Mark F: Let me ask what how you would handle a situation "M" whom I wrote about above, is a 40 something woman who was baptized as an infant in the Catholic church and also as a small child in a mainline Protestant church with which we don’t have intercommunion. She attends mass weekly. She's a good amateur metal smith and whenever she learns anyone is r troubled she makes them a crucifix or guardian angel. She also has until recently lived with "Slimeball" , her long term boyfriend. She joins us at the sports bar after mass and while she drinks in moderation, she clearly is a heavy drug user when she’s not working.. She's hinted she's had sex with other women (One of the ladies in the parish commented jocularly "No surprise if her standard for men is "Slimeball.”) About two years ago, because she got into a respectful disagreement with our pastor and went over to the Episcopalian Church. Aftwer gentle persuasion a group of us convinced her to come back to mass and dump Slimeball. Mark – This is about all I know. Wood you, fell qualified to tell M whether or not she’s should present herself for communion? How would you handle it? One more thing – If the drug use came out, she’d lose her security clearance and thus her job. Talking to a priest is legally protected by seal of confession. A talk with you or me isn’t.
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 8:26 AM By Abeca Christian
RR I'm afraid that Rita probably has already left the church. I was always taught that when we continue in grave mortal sin, that spiritually we have already abandoned the church. But never mind that, I have much compassion for Rita, it is only God that can heal her/him. May we continue to pray for many who have these difficult sins that make them slaves to those sins and make it hard for them to heal. May they find healing and turn away from these mortal sins that have and continue to scandalize our society as a whole.
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 3:39 PM By Canisius
Grisha of course you are not qualified to tell anyone whether they can receive communion. As a liberal you cannot make coherent judgments on right and wrong. So as someone who is anti-liberal and anti-progressive and can tell right from wrong, If a person is in a state of mortal sin you cannot receive communion period. Why is it so hard for liberals to understand this, curious Grisha do you go to confession at all and if so how often.
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 4:04 PM By The Truth Hurts
Mark F, Whoa Nellie! Speaking of marking certain Catholic schools off of lists, I think for now you need to mark Grisha off of your solid Catholic list. Grisha words can sometimes be as charming as quicksand with an outer oasis appeal. Remember how Adam and Eve fell in love with the words of the slippery serpent but before long they were biting that apple of dissent too. Mark each time you feel compelled to completely ignore Grisha's dissent from Catholicism Google up You Tube Quicksand Martha Reeves and the Vandellas. This should help you to not fall for a slippery sloper's words. This can be applied to anyone who thinks they can pull out a person who is mired in quicksand by obstinate choice. Grisha likes it there. The person mired down usually has more success in pulling the helper right in with them. When you listen to the words of this song think of Eve singing it to the slippery serpent who was our very first dissenter. ..Then when it comes to Grisha proceed with grace, truth, and great caution! Since Grisha likes to bring up the past, I thought that he would also enjoy a trip back to the 60's. Our first concern though is Grisha's real authentic conversion to Catholicism in 2009! Just a few days before 2010....How about it Grisha? Please start reading those books!
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 7:13 PM By Anne T.
To your December 23, 4:04 pm post, The Truth Hurts, I say exactly. From what he has posted all along and on another article's blog, Grisha wants to bring back dissenters, not those who will be faithful Catholics. You are right to warn MarkF to watch out.
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 8:30 PM By Grisha
Canisius: Do I understand you correctly that a politically liberal lay Catholic is not qualified to tell someone about whether they can receive communion but a politically conservative lay Catholic is??? By the way, in San Francisco I am considered a conservative. As to your personal questions the answers are 1) Yes and 2) Not enough. TTH: I'm sorry I don't understand your last post. Maybe if I read it when I'm fresh in the morning, I'll be able to answer you. What books do you refer to. Mark F. has recommended Cardinal Ratzinger's Truth and Tolerance which I'm going to read. Maybe I'll have some Reading suggestions tomorrow. Been a rough, long day. Lost a friend unexpectedly. Everyone REJOICE!
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Posted Wednesday, December 23, 2009 10:31 PM By Abeca Christian
Kenneth M. Fisher you speak beautiful words! MarkF listen well to the warning you've been given regarding Grisha, they are factual and charitable.
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Posted Thursday, December 24, 2009 7:29 AM By Rita
If I may ..... could I for a moment focus on the the original purpose of this thread and the heart with which I originally posted? I came here happy that there was a Catholic learning institution that was actually open to learning about persons like me and I wanted to extend my appreciation of that, though as always, I have problems expressing my thoughts the way I would like.
Now for other comments: I left the Catholic church years ago and it had nothing to do with being transgendered as at that time I was in deep denial of that aspect. Just being honest and upfront. My concern is the tone on here .... to disagree is one thing .... to be so ...how shall I say this ..... hurtful in a spiritually violent sort of way ..... that I don't understand. I was particularly surprised on how I was analysed, labelled sinful, and suspected of things and that no one even considered asking me...... why is that??? I was also surprised that anyone even offering me any sort of compassion or ...heaven forbid ..... welcome .... was jumped on in a particularly nasty way by some. Grisha (and others)....my apologies for bringing this upon you. If this is your version of Catholicism then I shall leave you to it and I shall be happy to stay away. I have quite a number of Catholic relatives and friends that are quite devout in their faith and I shall be content to regard the Catholic church in a very positive way based on how they live and how they love and treat me. As for my walk with God, hear this .... I love Jesus deeply and Jesus loves me, and yes I have sin in my life as many of us do (I shall not speak for you). My walk with God is between God and me. God and God alone will help me deal with the sin in my life whatever it may be and I trust in God for that. This is the Christmas season, that special child came for me too, born of a virgin, Emmanuel...God with us.... Goodbye ....last post..... my welcome has worn thin.
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Posted Thursday, December 24, 2009 8:17 AM By JLS
Grisha, you are clearly resorting to the false rhetoric so systematically used by Maguire, which is to switch the topic. You have now slyly placed everyone in the camp of being either liberal or conservative ... what deceit! You have framed your own argument to make it appear as if you are engaging someone else's argument ... just like Maguire does. On top of that you rebuke the Pope, and several hundred bishops and the Magisterium by demoting them to opinion pieces. The Church teaches that a voter is sinning when furthering a politician who works against God and the Church. All the liberal politicians at this time are opposing the Church. Your reception of Holy Communion, Grisha, is tainted by your evil advocacy. You are bringing down condemnation on your own head and trying to sucker others into joining you in your Hell bound spiritual journey.
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Posted Thursday, December 24, 2009 8:27 AM By JLS
Rita, who are you putting on? Your religious views are not even close to being Catholic. You admit to harboring a load of sin but you express zero intention to get rid of it ... This sort of attitude is anathema to Christ. Your relatives who indulge you and your sins are not devout as you claim; if they were, then they'd direct you towards the Confessional. Your vapid proclamations of how honest and sincere you are make no sense. Are you on this blog simply to practice seduction? If you are rather seeking Jesus, then do what He commands and give up your sin, and stop boasting about how evil you can be while pulling the wool over the eyes of Catholics.
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Posted Thursday, December 24, 2009 11:41 AM By Mark from PA
Rita, thank you for sharing your thoughts with us. You are so right, that special child came for you too. I can see the goodness in your soul by what you have written. Do not be discouraged and trust in God's love for you. I wish you Christmas blessings and peace and to all here I wish a joyful and Christmas. God bless you.
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Posted Thursday, December 24, 2009 4:03 PM By Mark from PA
To all here I wish a joyful and merry Christmas.
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Posted Friday, February 12, 2010 12:50 PM By james
I saw a very disturbing flyer today that was posted in the lobby of a medical office not too far from Dominican University. The flyer was for a one day retreat titled: "Women, Fairies, Angels and goddesses". The retreat is being held at Dominican University. Sounds like the old hippies are alive and well at this school.
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